1973 Celica ST (considering subframe connectors)

[white_cross]

Sorry the link is not working for the rocker panels not sure why. I guess they will be here at the end of next week I will post up pictures then.

 

On another note I figured out how to get a bunch of Toyota guys all excited and up set just post this kind of comment on a 1st gen celica facebook group page: 

 

"I was talking with a friend who is a mechanic and he was listing off different engine options that he thought would be sweet in my 1972 Celica. He was telling me about the Ford Duratec inline four engine. I sort of said I would look at it but did not really consider it. Then I started looking at this motor online and found out there are piles of performance parts for this motor (eg costorth and SBD) that can put it up to 280-300hp. It is all aluminum. weighs less than 300lbs. closer to the 200lb range. Any one look at this motor before as an option for a celica swap? I am thinking that this motor could be a unique swap and something worth considering."

 

Man did those guys ever get worked up I am not too picky with motor options just something to make it a fun, fast, reliable car. Sure keeping it Toyota powered would be ideal but I like to think out side the box and not copy what every one else does. I also can't deny the affordability of the Duratec. Plus I love hot rods. I am reminded of how many 1932 fords have a small block chevy or a Hemi in them. 

[white_cross]

Couple Duratec links to check out:

 

http://www.sbdev.co.uk/Duratec/Duratec%20Parts%20Catalogue.htm

http://www.locostusa.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=14753

http://www.cosworth.com/products/crate-engines/duratec-engines/

 

Not saying I am set on this motor Just an interesting option.

[white_cross]

Yesterday I dropped off the FJ at the body shop to get painted. They still have the original paint books from the 1970's. Perfect! I can look at all the colors that were offered on my Toyota model year and pick something that is factory correct for the year. I am leaning toward on of the blues. I always wanted a blue celica.

 

 

 

[white_cross]

My new rockers came in the other day. They are really nice pieces:

 

 

I am looking forward to repairing the floor now to get the driver side made up and installed. I am now removing the gauge cluster and dash pad. Slowly this thing is coming along.

[TRDTurko]

I like 802 or even 701.

[white_cross]

I like 802 or even 701.

Interesting those were my top two choices also!

 

This is what 701 looks like on the car: 

 

802 I have not seen yet.

[Beau]

Saw a nice one parked on the street this weekend. Crappy photo, but it was a nice looking car. Looked to be restored quite well. These cars look pretty cool in person.

 

I can see why you like them, being a Mustang guy, as they are visually quite similar in style. Looking at Wikipedia to learn a bit about these cars, apparently back in the 70s they were known as a Japanese Mustang. 

 

[Jim Eh.]

The lowered one above reminds me more of a late 60's Camero.

[white_cross]

Saw a nice one parked on the street this weekend. Crappy photo, but it was a nice looking car. Looked to be restored quite well. These cars look pretty cool in person.

 

I can see why you like them, being a Mustang guy, as they are visually quite similar in style. Looking at Wikipedia to learn a bit about these cars, apparently back in the 70s they were known as a Japanese Mustang. 

 

Sweet. Rare find for sure. I have never seen a restored one before! That was in Winnipeg?

 

The lowered one above reminds me more of a late 60's Camero.

 

I can totally see Camero from the side view!

[MRS Joe]

http://www.ebay.com/itm/JDM-Toyota-Altezza-RS200-Engine-swap-6-speed-manual-RWD-AE86-Swap-2-0L-Dual-VVTI-/121753554751?hash=item1c5913cf3f&vxp=mtr

Great deal.

[white_cross]

http://www.ebay.com/itm/JDM-Toyota-Altezza-RS200-Engine-swap-6-speed-manual-RWD-AE86-Swap-2-0L-Dual-VVTI-/121753554751?hash=item1c5913cf3f&vxp=mtr

Great deal.

Sure is thanks for the heads up. I found this place here in canada: http://www.japandirectjapanese.com/home.php?cat=2 

So no duty and really reasonable shipping. 

I have narrowed my motor options down to three now:

 

A) Beams with the 6 speed.

Like:

-Price I can get them shipped to my place for under $2000

-that is Toyota

-all aluminum which is light weight and makes for good weight balance

-has a 6 speed.

-I can keep my original gauge cluster layout with gauges from a supra (seen it done)

-very reliable, I can go on the road trips to calafornia etc that I plan on doing with out worrying about braking down

 

Dislike: 

- Not as much power as F20C

-parts can not be picked up at a local dealer they have to be shipped in from Japan

 

B)18RG

Like:

-Old school Toyota motor

-looks very cool in the car

-Easiest swap 

-No fire wall or trans tunnel cutting

 

Dislike:

-Very hard to find parts

-Very rare so if it brakes I may be out of luck fixing it

-Expensive to make lots of power on.

 

F20C:

Likes:

-Power is amazing when in the celica (will share in a bit)

-I can get parts right in Winkler at the Honda dealer or Piston ring

-Also very reliable for long road trips that I have planed.

-all aluminum again makes a better weight distribution

-6 speed

-Celica will have a quicker quarter mile time than my mach 1 by a little bit.

 

Dislike:

-Not toyota

-I have to run the s2000 gauge cluster, thus ruining my very retro and sweet celica cluster layout

-don't like the digital gauge cluster in a retro car like this.

-also have to cut trans tunnel and fire wall.

-double the price of the beams

 

I also was talking with Ray Santos the co founder of 1stgencelica.com he built a Celica like mine with the F20C and these are his thoughts on the F20C:

"I had to cut the firewall and transmission tunnel to fit the motor and drive train. It is possible to run the factory console but not without trimming to fit. I used the Honda S2000 cluster and grafted it onto the celica cluster for a factory look.

You can do the beams but you would spend a lot of money trying to get the same power the F20C has stock.

As far as performance goes the celica is much lighter than the Honda S2000 and acceleration is really quick. Not sure of 0-60 but it runs low 13's in the 1/4 mile on street tires. I even bested a turbocharged Honda S2000 once. I've even kept up with a few motorcycles.

Hope that helps. The F20C motor is one of the best 4 bangers out there. I haven't added any power adders or money into my swap and it still gets 25+ MPG!"

[Corey]

Honda K-series?

I've been lusting over a K-Miata for a while.

[white_cross]

Does K-series come in rear wheel drive?

[frs_jeremy]

Not from the factory, no.  But kmiata has a bunch of parts that let you use a miata transmission with it:

http://www.shop.kmiata.com/

 

So, realistically, if you budget ~2k for the kmiata stuff, and some additional money to get power level of the K up to the F20C, a full F20C swap starts to seem reasonably priced.

 

I think the "Easy Button" solution for engine swaps like this (if there is such a thing) right now is the Ford/Mazda duratec motor with an NC miata or ranger transmission, or some kind of GM Ecotec setup with the solstice trans like Mark is using. 

[MRS Joe]

No, but they make adapters to mate it to several rwd gearboxes

[nopistons]

1UZFE with W58, Cheap, plentiful, local.

 

Whatever you do, keep it Toyota.

I struggled with this with my AE86.

[MRS Joe]

a good w58 is still $500-1k. Every one I have found needs synchros.

Also note the 1200 to adapt the two together with a new clutch, modded flywheel, hydraulic clutch assy.

[Magner]

If you decide to go with k series you could save money by initially getting a basic k20 or k24 from the base rsx or crv respectively.Later with more funds a "hotter" k series could be dropped in or built. The kmiata being buolt for One lap of America is going this route. Search onelapmiata on facebook for project details.

As Jeremy mentioned the ecotec stuff works too, a bonus the Cayon/Colorado 5spd transmissions are identical (except 3rd gear IIRC) and easier to find than the solstice transmissions.

[white_cross]

Not from the factory, no.  But kmiata has a bunch of parts that let you use a miata transmission with it:

http://www.shop.kmiata.com/

 

So, realistically, if you budget ~2k for the kmiata stuff, and some additional money to get power level of the K up to the F20C, a full F20C swap starts to seem reasonably priced.

 

I think the "Easy Button" solution for engine swaps like this (if there is such a thing) right now is the Ford/Mazda duratec motor with an NC miata or ranger transmission, or some kind of GM Ecotec setup with the solstice trans like Mark is using. 

 

I will check out the link you sent me. My friend who is a Ford Mechanic got me hooked on th duratec a while back. At first I was like no thanks then I looked them up and there is a pile of performance parts out there. Even a dedicated swap harnesses to make it an easy job. I posted this swap idea on a Toyota forum and to see if any one had considered it for a 1st gen Celica as an option. I got so much flack for just asking the question I actually removed my post. But I think it is a really good option. I don't mind being different. I love hot rodding so I have no issues with swapping a motor from another brand. It happens often with a 1932 ford running a chevy or hemi no one gives it a second thought.

 

1UZFE with W58, Cheap, plentiful, local.

 

Whatever you do, keep it Toyota.

I struggled with this with my AE86.

 

What did end up happening with your AE86?

 

If you decide to go with k series you could save money by initially getting a basic k20 or k24 from the base rsx or crv respectively.Later with more funds a "hotter" k series could be dropped in or built. The kmiata being buolt for One lap of America is going this route. Search onelapmiata on facebook for project details.

As Jeremy mentioned the ecotec stuff works too, a bonus the Cayon/Colorado 5spd transmissions are identical (except 3rd gear IIRC) and easier to find than the solstice transmissions.

So a rwd is possible very cool all stuff to consider.

[frs_jeremy]

If you decide to go with k series you could save money by initially getting a basic k20 or k24 from the base rsx or crv respectively.Later with more funds a "hotter" k series could be dropped in or built. The kmiata being buolt for One lap of America is going this route. Search onelapmiata on facebook for project details.

 

 

white_cross,

 

If you decide to go this route, let me know as I have a base rsx motor and 5-speed ecu you could have at a very reasonable price.

[nopistons]

What did end up happening with your AE86?

 

 

For right now its all original. In the spring I will likely toy with the idea of the 1UZ-FE swap. It's not that expensive if you look around.

I was going to put in a supercharged or turbocharged L67 (GM 3800 V6) as I have a few to choose from in my shop but decided to go all Toyota.

 

a good w58 is still $500-1k. Every one I have found needs synchros. 

Also note the 1200 to adapt the two together with a new clutch, modded flywheel, hydraulic clutch assy. 

 

 

Luckily for me, I have two that don't! They came out of cars that I drove (one that I've track'd).

 

$575 for the swap bell and flywheel kit that uses the stock W58 pitch fork and cylinder

 

Clutch...well, we all know the sky is the limit when it comes to purchasing those.

[MRS Joe]

What did end up happening with your AE86?

For right now its all original. In the spring I will likely toy with the idea of the 1UZ-FE swap. It's not that expensive if you look around.

I was going to put in a supercharged or turbocharged L67 (GM 3800 V6) as I have a few to choose from in my shop but decided to go all Toyota.

a good w58 is still $500-1k. Every one I have found needs synchros.

Also note the 1200 to adapt the two together with a new clutch, modded flywheel, hydraulic clutch assy.

Luckily for me, I have two that don't! They came out of cars that I drove (one that I've track'd).

$575 for the swap bell and flywheel kit that uses the stock W58 pitch fork and cylinder

Clutch...well, we all know the sky is the limit when it comes to purchasing those.

If you can post a link to the w58 swap kit you speak of, I'd appreciate it. A clutch shouldn't be more then $200.

I'd still consider a manual trans in my build if I could put it together at a reasonable cost.

There are many options available, just watch mark's rwd ecotech build for the mg.

I'd personally go with a Toyota driveline or a kseries Honda if I had to veer. With kpro tuning and bolt on mods you'd do anyway, guys are getting 260+whp.

[nopistons]

Just my $0.02, I found EMS-4 is an easier setup than k-pro for my K24 build. You don't have to buy stuff twice and EMS-4 has base maps included when you purchase.

 

Link for bell kit: http://www.ebay.com/itm/271976764636?_trksid=p2055119.m1438.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT

 

That is a current listing but I have an old one in my watch list for $399 plus flywheel. Guess prices change.

 

I have a W58 to 4AGE bell done the same way as the listing and it looks like a decent assembly.

[white_cross]

Just watched this: https:  

is my car down to the color and "ST" model. 

 

 

 

 

If you decide to go with k series you could save money by initially getting a basic k20 or k24 from the base rsx or crv respectively.Later with more funds a "hotter" k series could be dropped in or built. The kmiata being buolt for One lap of America is going this route. Search onelapmiata on facebook for project details.
 

 

white_cross,

 

If you decide to go this route, let me know as I have a base rsx motor and 5-speed ecu you could have at a very reasonable price.

 

 

Thanks I will keep that in mind.

 

 

What did end up happening with your AE86?

 

 

For right now its all original. In the spring I will likely toy with the idea of the 1UZ-FE swap. It's not that expensive if you look around.

I was going to put in a supercharged or turbocharged L67 (GM 3800 V6) as I have a few to choose from in my shop but decided to go all Toyota.

 

a good w58 is still $500-1k. Every one I have found needs synchros. 
Also note the 1200 to adapt the two together with a new clutch, modded flywheel, hydraulic clutch assy. 

 

 

Luckily for me, I have two that don't! They came out of cars that I drove (one that I've track'd).

 

$575 for the swap bell and flywheel kit that uses the stock W58 pitch fork and cylinder

 

Clutch...well, we all know the sky is the limit when it comes to purchasing those.

 

 

I hope to see your AE86 they are cool cars. Is yours a hatch back? Maybe a ride in it some day

[white_cross]

The ztec reminds me a lot of a 4age in this video: 

Just kind of interesting. I am guessing the ztec in old Escorts is the modern engine upgrade for it like a beams would be for a Toyota guy. I had a contour with the ztec and it was no hot rod, I guess with the right parts they can preform. I love the sound of this one.

[nopistons]

 

 

I hope to see your AE86 they are cool cars. Is yours a hatch back? Maybe a ride in it some day

 

Yes it is a hatchback.

If I still have it, I'm sure we can work something out! haha

[white_cross]

 

 

 

I hope to see your AE86 they are cool cars. Is yours a hatch back? Maybe a ride in it some day

 

Yes it is a hatchback.

If I still have it, I'm sure we can work something out! haha

 

Sweet Deal. I almost had one of these for my first car!

 

So last night a friend of mine came down to help me pull the motor and trans out of the car:

 

Its out. At this point we were trying to separate the motor and trans so I could put the motor on my stand. Well it would not go. for some reason the input shaft will not slide out. 

 

 

So getting a lot closer to sand blast time. I want the shell bare for sand blasting the floor and engine bay. Then I can see exactly how much metal work is needed. 

[Jim Eh.]

After sandblasting take it to a field somewhere with a high powered air compressor and blow out all the accumulated media from all the nooks and crannies. Probably 3 - 5 lbs of blast media stuck in all sorts of places. Even with that, once you get it on a rotisserie you will find more media. 

[white_cross]

After sandblasting take it to a field somewhere with a high powered air compressor and blow out all the accumulated media from all the nooks and crannies. Probably 3 - 5 lbs of blast media stuck in all sorts of places. Even with that, once you get it on a rotisserie you will find more media. 

Good plan thanks for the idea. The last guy did some blasting on the car and I am still getting sand out of it from that. 

[Jim Eh.]

Don't forget to wear repository protection. If it's silica they used you really don't want to ingest it mixed with the nasty kind of coatings they used back in the day.