mzf Posted March 12, 2008 Posted March 12, 2008 After having spoken with a good portion of the people involved with course design, I've decided to make a small change to accomodate the majority and keep things running smoothly.5 events this season will be done using courses drawn out before the event, following the procedures discussed in this thread. The remaining 12 courses this season will be done as it was in the past, by an on-site committee.Just to make the course design law more clear, here's a short summary:Pre-designed courses-designs will be submitted online before the event-criticism and ideas will be made on the forums-once a final design has been agreed upon, that course will be set up-upon setting up and testing the course, the ONLY changes to be made on site will be for safety related issuesOn-site course design-committee of people (anyone is welcome) will create the course on site-comments and opinions are welcome during setupCriticism, opinions, and ideas after the event has concluded are welcome (and encouraged) and will potentially be incorporated in future events.As I mentioned at the top, this decision was made after having spoken to most of the people regularily involved in course design. Opinions on course designs are always welcome at the time they are being created.Thanks,
conebasher Posted March 12, 2008 Posted March 12, 2008 how do we know which events are which and are we doing this to determine a better way of doing things or is it an attempt to make everyone happy?
mzf Posted March 12, 2008 Author Posted March 12, 2008 Both, and which events are which can be figured out. I'm just waiting to find out which events will have to be set up the morning of and which events will be the night before.
Fast_Toys Posted March 12, 2008 Posted March 12, 2008 Mike,I am ok with your decision but how can you achieve a balanced course design by committee on site with no planning? Can you elaborate on the process that will be used?
mzf Posted March 12, 2008 Author Posted March 12, 2008 It's potentially the same as when it's done beforehand. It will most likely be the same people involved in suggesting changes, if not more people (observation based on degree of support I've received for each method). There are a few things we will keep an eye our for, such as avoiding very tight sections, which I realize is a concern for some parties (possibly even the precipitating factor in the push for pre-designed courses). Every effort will be made using each method to create a fair, safe, and fun course for everyone.Also, once we have a better idea of when we will have site access for each event, you guys can let me know which events are more convenient for making a Roger Johnson-style (by which I mean pre-designed) course.
Fast_Toys Posted March 12, 2008 Posted March 12, 2008 Ok. To try and increase interest in course design, would you be able to post something in the general forum indicating that anyone can submit course designs? If you do that, please include the link to the template.Kerry: Can we make it some sort of a contest with a prize for chosen entries?I'd really like to see more people participating in this. If everyone has input, it results in less complaints overall.
Kerry Posted March 12, 2008 Posted March 12, 2008 Kerry: Can we make it some sort of a contest with a prize for chosen entries?What do you have in mind?
Fast_Toys Posted March 12, 2008 Posted March 12, 2008 What do you have in mind?Some ideas:Crew prize if that is being done this yearWSCC or Auto-x TshirtFree event entryI think we should also acknowledge who the course designer was at the end of day driver meetings.
mzf Posted March 12, 2008 Author Posted March 12, 2008 Ok. To try and increase interest in course design' date=' would you be able to post something in the general forum indicating that anyone can submit course designs? If you do that, please include the link to the template.Kerry: Can we make it some sort of a contest with a prize for chosen entries?I'd really like to see more people participating in this. If everyone has input, it results in less complaints overall.[/quote']Post in the public areas coming soon. I just need to go back through the old threads and find the approriate blank maps to use.Contest sounds fine to me. I'd like more people to get involved. As to prizes, if someone comes up with a nice, clean design for a t-shirt then we might be able to get something done. I suck at designing shirts so I won't even try with that one. The shirts can be used as event giveaways for people who contributed in other areas besides course design as well. Or we can do something else if there's any suggestions. It's also up to Kerry to allocate a few hun for the shirts (if we do that).
Fast_Toys Posted March 12, 2008 Posted March 12, 2008 As to prizes' date=' if someone comes up with a nice, clean design for a t-shirt then we might be able to get something done. I suck at designing shirts so I won't even try with that one. The shirts can be used as event giveaways for people who contributed in other areas besides course design as well. Or we can do something else if there's any suggestions. It's also up to Kerry to allocate a few hun for the shirts (if we do that).[/quote']Another great idea. There are lots of local places that can print shirts once someone comes up with a design. Why not post that in the public forum too? We have lots of creative people in the club!
mzf Posted March 12, 2008 Author Posted March 12, 2008 The one problem with doing shirts is we usually have some done for the regionals. It doesn't really make sense to have two different shirts made this year. If someone can think of something other than a shirt, that might work better.
Kerry Posted March 12, 2008 Posted March 12, 2008 Actually, just thought of something. We still have a bunch of those stainless steel WSCC travel thermos' sitting around somewhere. We could give one of those away...
mzf Posted March 12, 2008 Author Posted March 12, 2008 Actually' date=' just thought of something. We still have a bunch of those stainless steel WSCC travel thermos' sitting around somewhere. We could give one of those away...[/quote']Cool, those were really nice. Works for me.
SoloSnapshots Posted March 12, 2008 Posted March 12, 2008 I just need to go back through the old threads and find the approriate blank maps to use..Does anyone still have a map with measurements on it for things like the grates?
justkickin Posted March 12, 2008 Posted March 12, 2008 Does anyone still have a map with measurements on it for things like the grates?Was one ever finalized? I don't recall seeing it. If one exists I wouldn't mind a copy and I can take a shot at the bezier curve stuff.
mzf Posted March 13, 2008 Author Posted March 13, 2008 There was one semi-complete blank map posted at the beginning of last year.
Fast_Toys Posted March 13, 2008 Posted March 13, 2008 There was one semi-complete blank map posted at the beginning of last year.It's pretty good. It has all the manhole covers. The only thing that needs to be added is the dip.Speaking of the dip, is there anyway we can get it fixed (even if we have to pay for it as a club)? It's actually not very big, it just needs some ashphalt and a roller.
Kerry Posted March 13, 2008 Posted March 13, 2008 We talked to the RRX about that once, and mentioned that we'd look into paying for it. They weren't interested.They expect the site to be changing... sooner rather than later.
Fast_Toys Posted March 13, 2008 Posted March 13, 2008 We talked to the RRX about that once' date=' and mentioned that we'd look into paying for it. They weren't interested.They expect the site to be changing... sooner rather than later.[/quote']Kerry: I vaguely remember Sue I mentioning that but the answer was more like "nobody else is complaining" and I am not sure the WSCC offered to pay for it or arrange to have it fixed etc. If the offer was in fact made and they said no, then we are stuck. But if the offer wasn't made in that manner, it might be worth revisitting. That spot is getting worse and really limits what we can do with the transition.
mzf Posted March 13, 2008 Author Posted March 13, 2008 It was made. We were told that RRX is currently working on plans to redevelop that whole area and so we will probably lose our site at some time in the next 2-3 years.Basically, start praying that Safety Services MB builds their facility and that we will be allowed access to the infield for a reasonable price. Otherwise there will be no autox in Winnipeg. But that's another discussion altogether.
Fast_Toys Posted March 13, 2008 Posted March 13, 2008 I personally spoke with them last year. Ok Doky. That sucks that they would turn down free work!
STi_Sue Posted March 18, 2008 Posted March 18, 2008 how do we know which events are which......and which events are which can be figured out. I'm just waiting to find out which events will have to be set up the morning of and which events will be the night before.I understand there are pros and cons to each course design approach, but I would respectfully suggest that you consider making the weeknight events some of the five pre-planned courses.These events are hectic enough as is without worrying about course issues, like finding out at 5:00 that the finish is not safe or not being sure how long the course is and having the event run until 9:00 (therefore not being able to leave the park until 10:00). Just speaking from past experience.
Art Posted March 18, 2008 Posted March 18, 2008 I personally spoke with them last year. What kind of discussion was it? a) "It would be really nice if that dip could be fixed." or "We really need to have that dip fixed and are willing to pay the full cost of the repair. It's a safety issue, cars are getting damaged because of it and it severely hampers course design."
Kerry Posted March 18, 2008 Posted March 18, 2008 What kind of discussion was it? a) "It would be really nice if that dip could be fixed." or "We really need to have that dip fixed and are willing to pay the full cost of the repair. It's a safety issue' date=' cars are getting damaged because of it and it severely hampers course design."[/quote']It was a discussion brought up between Tim, Chris, Mike, Myself and the rep from the RRX when we were doing event planning last year. As I'm sure you can respect, I do not remember all the details of a conversation I had a year ago.However, when we began to discuss this and offered our solutions, it was made very clear to us that they would not be doing any changes to the lot. Also, that there was a very real possibility that we not be able to use the lot for much longer.We're all on the same team, we would like the dip fixed as much as anyone else. That's why we asked about it last year.
justkickin Posted March 18, 2008 Posted March 18, 2008 To add to Kerry's comment. The response from the RRx was along the lines of (to paraphrase as my recollection isn't that great after a year either) "...nobody else has a problem with the dip...not even the RCMP so we will not be repairing it." The RRX apepars to be more concerned with huge holes vs unevenness in the asphalt.
Jeff Posted March 18, 2008 Posted March 18, 2008 "...nobody else has a problem with the dip...not even the RCMP so we will not be repairing it."haha no kidding. Potholes and dips only add to the realism of their training procedures.
Art Posted March 18, 2008 Posted March 18, 2008 The response from the RRx was ..... "so we will not be repairing it."This, in combination with reading back through the thread suggests to me that the "a)" approach was taken. Personally, I'd like to see the dip fixed at our expense, even if it's just for 1 season to ensure safety, reduce vehicle damage and to free up course design. Maybe I'm out to lunch here but I can't see why the RRX would object to that. On the other hand maybe there are just a few of us that think it's an issue. :shrug:
Jeff Posted March 18, 2008 Posted March 18, 2008 I'll second that. As long as we have it professionally repaired, why would anyone object to a free improvement?
Kerry Posted March 18, 2008 Posted March 18, 2008 This' date=' in combination with reading back through the thread suggests to me that the "a)" approach was taken.[/quote']I appreciate your concern, but I can assure you that we did not all just collectively say "Hey, how about we fix that bump, eh?", and step aside when he said "No". Do I come across as a guy who accepts 'no' when I see something I want? :pConsider this, there's a possibility that we may not have the use of the RRX site next year. You think fixing the bump half way through the season is a good use of our time if we're going to be done at the end of the year anyway?To be clear, that has not been confirmed or denied at this point. But it weighs very high on the list of things to clarify.
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