Requirements for Time Attack

[Kurtisj]

Hello, I’m planning on making it to the July and august events but I’m not sure exactly what I’ll need be I have completed other than the OTA. I’m not able to do the competition license and race school track day due to work, will that cause issues for me to trying to compete in the July and August track days?

[donrolandofurioso]

Hello and welcome!

Can you be a bit more specific in your statement? What are you referring to when you mention that you have completed the OTA?

Generally speaking, track days (hotlapping) does not require you to have attended the License & Race School, as Hotlapping is not a sanctioned race. Participation in the Mini School held at the track during your first event will suffice.

However, if you want to compete in Time Attack, you must have a license, which you need to qualify for during a Rache & Licensing School. As k away if you have any questions...

[David Klassen]

@donrolandofurioso did you mean Race & Licensing School? Like our Competition License School?

[Kurtisj]

3 hours ago, donrolandofurioso said:

Hello and welcome!

Can you be a bit more specific in your statement? What are you referring to when you mention that you have completed the OTA?

Generally speaking, track days (hotlapping) does not require you to have attended the License & Race School, as Hotlapping is not a sanctioned race. Participation in the Mini School held at the track during your first event will suffice.

However, if you want to compete in Time Attack, you must have a license, which you need to qualify for during a Rache & Licensing School. As k away if you have any questions...

Hello. Might have worded my question, I’m wanting to do track days, but I’m not going to be there for the full season. Are the hot lapping days different than the the time attack days? 
 

For the OTA I have my car completed with the mods but I haven’t submitted for the PIP to completed because I found a harness that works in tandem with the factory seat belt. 

[David Klassen]

HPDE Days (used to be called Hot Lapping or Track Days):

• non-competitive 
• no timing
• mini-school instruction 
• car must be wider than tall
• does not require roll protection in a coupe, roll protection required in a convertible 
• novices (Yellow Wristband ) have a speed limit, drivers could graduate to Green Wristband (no speed limit in a day)
• Green Wristband drivers can have a passenger 

Time Attack Days:

• Saturdays & Sundays
• requires a completion license 
• Timed laps
• car must be classed OTA
• car must be wider than tall
• does not require roll protection in a coupe, roll protection required in a convertible
• no passengers

New for 2023, HPDE sessions run in between Time Attack sessions:

• Limited number of Green Wristband Drivers
• Saturdays & Sundays

[Kurtisj]

1 hour ago, David Klassen said:

HPDE Days (used to be called Hot Lapping or Track Days):

• non-competitive 
• no timing
• mini-school instruction 
• car must be wider than tall
• does not require roll protection in a coupe, roll protection required in a convertible 
• novices (Yellow Wristband ) have a speed limit, drivers could graduate to Green Wristband (no speed limit in a day)
• Green Wristband drivers can have a passenger 

Time Attack Days:

• Saturdays & Sundays
• requires a completion license 
• Timed laps
• car must be classed OTA
• car must be wider than tall
• does not require roll protection in a coupe, roll protection required in a convertible
• no passengers

New for 2023, HPDE sessions run in between Time Attack sessions:

• Limited number of Green Wristband Drivers
• Saturdays & Sundays

Ok, best bet for me then is the HPDE days. I’m guessing a harness that clips into the factory seat belt is over kill or is it suggested to use one when I use a bucket seat? I know with using the factory seat belt with a bucket seat isn’t the best idea but can be done. I’m guessing there’s also a tech inspection and I’ll be needing to meet some standards too?

[David Klassen]

Check out

 

[David Klassen]

Also note that this is not a HPDE Track Day regulation but is wise advice from the Drift supplementary regulations:

Restraint Systems/Seat Belts and Seats

WARNING: The use of 4/5/6 point belts in a vehicle without a full roll cage can result in serious injury in the event of a rollover. When used in a vehicle without a full roll cage, the design of these systems does not allow side/downward movement of the head and shoulders and thereby exposes the head and neck to impact from a collapsed roof. The use of a 5 or 6-point belt systems in a car equipped with a roll cage is mandatory. NOTE: Refer to “1.3 ROLLOVER PROTECTION – ROLL BARS AND CAGES” in these Supplementary Regulations for a definition of the different types of rollover protection.: Add the following chart, regarding the relationship between harnesses/belts and the type of rollover protection fitted to the vehicle:

 blob:https://forums.wscc.mb.ca/8aa05baa-cd76-4298-aa32-f9bd3808e687 blob:https://forums.wscc.mb.ca/17cb64a5-202b-41c1-92ea-52b37402143d

*Breakaway and ASM shoulder straps are designed to release or tear away in the event of a frontal impact. The Anti-Submarining (ASM) shoulder belt typically consists of the inboard shoulder belt being fitted with a mechanism that releases an additional loop of webbing to allow the upper torso to twist and move forward in the event of a frontal impact. This, in effect, prevents sliding under the belt and also allows the head of the driver to move away from a collapsed roof in the event of a rollover.

[Kurtisj]

38 minutes ago, David Klassen said:

Check out

 

Sounds good. I’ll check if my exhaust complied with the noise regulation before coming, I’ve been told it’s fairly loud but there’s a leak near the headers so it might be a fair bit more quiet once I fix that. 

 

37 minutes ago, David Klassen said:

Also note that this is not a HPDE Track Day regulation but is wise advice from the Drift supplementary regulations:

Restraint Systems/Seat Belts and Seats

WARNING: The use of 4/5/6 point belts in a vehicle without a full roll cage can result in serious injury in the event of a rollover. When used in a vehicle without a full roll cage, the design of these systems does not allow side/downward movement of the head and shoulders and thereby exposes the head and neck to impact from a collapsed roof. The use of a 5 or 6-point belt systems in a car equipped with a roll cage is mandatory. NOTE: Refer to “1.3 ROLLOVER PROTECTION – ROLL BARS AND CAGES” in these Supplementary Regulations for a definition of the different types of rollover protection.: Add the following chart, regarding the relationship between harnesses/belts and the type of rollover protection fitted to the vehicle:

 blob:https://forums.wscc.mb.ca/8aa05baa-cd76-4298-aa32-f9bd3808e687 blob:https://forums.wscc.mb.ca/17cb64a5-202b-41c1-92ea-52b37402143d

*Breakaway and ASM shoulder straps are designed to release or tear away in the event of a frontal impact. The Anti-Submarining (ASM) shoulder belt typically consists of the inboard shoulder belt being fitted with a mechanism that releases an additional loop of webbing to allow the upper torso to twist and move forward in the event of a frontal impact. This, in effect, prevents sliding under the belt and also allows the head of the driver to move away from a collapsed roof in the event of a rollover.

So, in your more motor sports mind, would you recommend me using the factory belts with bucket seats? The main reason why I’m doing bucket seats is due to me having to have my seat at an awkward position and not being able to drive that easily and fast with a helmet on. 

[Tysawch]

On 1/24/2023 at 1:33 AM, Kurtisj said:

Ok, best bet for me then is the HPDE days. I’m guessing a harness that clips into the factory seat belt is over kill or is it suggested to use one when I use a bucket seat? I know with using the factory seat belt with a bucket seat isn’t the best idea but can be done. I’m guessing there’s also a tech inspection and I’ll be needing to meet some standards too?

I'm not familiar with the style harness you are referencing. something to note tho is all harness's have to be FIA approved and up to date. I have ran a stock seat belt with a bucket. it takes a bit to make sure everything works as intended and holds you correctly. I will have to look over our rules on the harnesses again but i don't actually see a way to run them without a cage. previously you could run a "ASM" style harness when we didn't require a neck restraint with the harness. Now that we do tho you would need the cage. From what I'm seeing tho you are more so just after seating position and some extra hold from the seat. i would say just make the stock belts work unless its a caged racecar, if so definitely would point you in the direction of adding the harness's and neck restraint

 

also note we also require the anti submarine strap (5 or 6 point belts)   

 

more info on the car/ set up and what your end goal is and we can make sure your 100% for when you get out to GMP

Edited January 26 by Tysawch
correcting information

[Kurtisj]

3 hours ago, Tysawch said:

I'm not familiar with the style harness you are referencing. something to note tho is all harness's have to be FIA approved and up to date. I have ran a stock seat belt with a bucket. it takes a bit to make sure everything works as intended and holds you correctly. I will have to look over our rules on the harnesses again but i don't actually see a way to run them without a cage. previously you could run a "ASM" style harness when we didn't require a neck restraint with the harness. Now that we do tho you would need the cage. From what I'm seeing tho you are more so just after seating position and some extra hold from the seat. i would say just make the stock belts work unless its a caged racecar, if so definitely would point you in the direction of adding the harness's and neck restraint

 

also note we also require the anti submarine strap (5 or 6 point belts)   

 

more info on the car/ set up and what your end goal is and we can make sure your 100% for when you get out to GMP

Car is an 04 325i, has coilovers, wheels, headers, cat back, catch can, m50 intake manifold, soon to be added CAI, soon to be added engine and transmission poly mounts, poly diff bushings, poly rear trailing arm bushings, soon to be added poly rear subframe bushings with the reinforcement plates and rear subframe brace, solid steering coupler. 
 

That’s it for mods right now, those are the for sure things being added before I will come out. I’ll make a link for the harness I was talking about. I’ll see if I’m able to make it to some form of track day or spirited driving with just the bucket seat and see how it does. 
 

https://www.schrothracing.com/item/schroth-quickfit-pro/

[Tysawch]

On 1/25/2023 at 11:34 PM, Kurtisj said:

Car is an 04 325i, has coilovers, wheels, headers, cat back, catch can, m50 intake manifold, soon to be added CAI, soon to be added engine and transmission poly mounts, poly diff bushings, poly rear trailing arm bushings, soon to be added poly rear subframe bushings with the reinforcement plates and rear subframe brace, solid steering coupler. 
 

That’s it for mods right now, those are the for sure things being added before I will come out. I’ll make a link for the harness I was talking about. I’ll see if I’m able to make it to some form of track day or spirited driving with just the bucket seat and see how it does. 
 

https://www.schrothracing.com/item/schroth-quickfit-pro/

ok so still a street car. The issue I'm seeing with the harnesses you linked is that they don't have a Fia certification. harnesses get tricky as some things they will do to make a "street legal" harness also make them un acceptable for the track. you would have to get a 4 point ASM style harness to be able to run a harness without rollover protection.

 

if your looking to stick with schroth racing this would be the harness you need 

https://www.schrothracing.com/item/profi-ii-asm/fia-4-point-asm

 

[Kurtisj]

22 minutes ago, Tysawch said:

ok so still a street car. The issue I'm seeing with the harnesses you linked is that they don't have a Fia certification. harnesses get tricky as some things they will do to make a "street legal" harness also make them un acceptable for the track. you would have to get a 4 point ASM style harness to be able to run a harness without rollover protection.

 

if your looking to stick with schroth racing this would be the harness you need 

https://www.schrothracing.com/item/profi-ii-asm/fia-4-point-asm

 

Ah, that part I was confused about. Thanks for helping me out, I’m thinking it’s best to just give it a shot with just the bucket seat and stock belt to see how it fares.